View Full Version : Updating Jeep "Maybe"
Hello all
Just getting some opinions on upgrading to a Wrangler in the near future, so not sure what to get yet though I'm only interested in a 4 door model AND I do like the look inside of the latest model, which I think was released Nov 2010. Much nicer. I beleive that a new v6 is coming out soon, so it may knock the prices down on older used models.
My question is - Is the diesel worth the extra over the petrol. Auto Vs Manual.
What should I be looking at as I doubt I can afford a new one.
Thanks
Steve
Paul-JK
24-09-11, 09:32 PM
The new interior is certainly more modern but for me it's a bit too soft. The older interior ('07-'10) is utilitarian, but so is a Wrangler, so I think it suits the car better. Having said that some of the new features are great. The new ones get tiptronic gear change on the diesel autos, steering wheel controls, power socket in the central arm rest and a tailgate door support which I think are all useful inclusions. Some of the new features aren't so clever though. There are more plastic covers in the boot in the new ones (around the bottom of the roll cage) which will look great for 2 minutes and will get scratched to hell after that and look terrible. The older version was all just carpet which is a lot more resilient. The sub woofer is also integrated into one of these plastic covers now, as is the tailgate support) which will mean that I doubt it can be removed. This will cause problems for some with load space. I took the sub woofer out of mine after a couple of weeks as it was getting in the way all of the time.
Anyway, my 10c worth.........
Diesel 'v' Petrol - I think the diesel suits the JK better (a more lazy driving style) and is the stronger engine, especially at freeway speeds, and even more so with the extra weight of the 4 dr.
Auto 'v' Manual - If you're going with the diesel then get the auto. The diesel/auto combo works well and the clutches in the manuals are known to be weak (too weak for torque of the diesel motor) and expensive to fix! From '08 onwards the auto also got an extra 50Nm torque over the manual as well (460Nm instead of 410Nm).
Paul
Either way, auto is the way to go...............
The new interior is certainly more modern but for me it's a bit too soft. The older interior ('07-'10) is utilitarian, but so is a Wrangler, so I think it suits the car better.
I think the JK could be a victim of its own success - its becoming more mainstream and so it will be gradually softened to appeal to Joe Citizen. In the next iteration we will see the windscreen angled back for a more aerodynamic shape....
Thanks so far - More comments are welcome guys
Do not forget about a "Rubicon" for few extra bucks if around/suitable etc.......................
rupicon
25-09-11, 10:14 PM
get the rubicon thats what idid
Read somewhere,-ajor I think- that someone had to get a curved replacement windscreen for their JK recently and that was all there was about, that is going in now to JK's............. Unsure in this area.........
The current issue of Overlander magazine has a write up on diesel auto vs petrol manual Wrangler.
According to them the break even point in price (allowing for servicing and fuel costs) is 650 000klms.
Not a good argument for a diesel, but I'd still buy one over the petrol any day.
How can it be that much. Wow! Ill have to get a copy
I asked myself the same question
I went out and got a copy of overlander. It was interesting read
Doesnt look like fuel cpnsuption is much different btw crd and petrol. One of my main concerns if you look long term
I wonder if the new petrol 2012 model will be good. I guess there will be some bargains late this year
Paul-JK
29-09-11, 09:21 AM
Haven't read the Overlander article but did they factor in the increase in fuel consumption when loaded. Admittedly not something that affects your everyday driving but the diesel should win out there. Also diesel should have higher resale so you get back a lot of the extra you paid anyway.
If you're going to do a lot of touring then I think the diesel is the way to go but if you just doing "normal" driving and local off road then it's probably more a case of personal preference between petrol & diesel rather there being a clear standout winner, especially with the new Penstar V6 that has better fuel economy.
I am running 2inch lift and 33inch Cooper Stts on my JK unlimited Petrol Auto..... I get about 15.5 Ltr/100 driving around town....... One of my friends has a Jk ultd diesel auto with a 2 inch lift stock tyres and he gets about 11.5 ltr/100 around town...... If u put muddies on his rig expect the consumption to go up a bit...... Thats the real world figures.... He paid $7500 more than me for his rig...... now u can work out how much time it will take to break even....... In the extre $7500 u can get a lot many mods on the petrol...... 2 inch lift $1200..... 33muddies $2000...... ARB front bar $1500...... Winch $1200....... Rear eaton e locker $1500...... Sway bar dicos $250........ total $7650........
Just my 2 cents worth......
Mani
So mine is a 4dr auto diesel and running 35" tyres I get about 13.2 Ltr/100Km but add 4.56 diff gears and the power and torque is UNBELIEVABLE especially when towing the camper trailer.
Only reason I would buy a petal is to take out the v6 and drop in a Hemi... hehehe
Looking on carsales there are heaps of diesels around at a great price, unless you want new but the $7k Mani is talking about saving you can find a great second hand one with that kind of saving anyway.
Mani
You make a very valid point.
Though I doubt I could afford a new one but most likely a late 2010 or early 2011 model as I like the new interior. It's more to do with the fuel consumption over a long term, especially when touring. But in saying that - Is the wrangler OK for long touring or even long tramac trips to your yearly summer holiday up the coast? I'd probably add an Aux fuel tank to extend the range. I'm hoping to do a long bush trip one day soon where you may need heaps of diesel. Which as I understand should use less fuel in low range than petrol
I am surprised the figures quoted for teh wrangler are so high as in comparison with my old fashion single cam 4.7l V8 uses 17-18 around town, 12-13 touring and about 15ish in the bush.
Ive got the long ranger tank on mine, has a total storage of 156 litres and lasts about 1200Km... all depends on that right foot you may have I suppose.
May be my 3.73 diff ratios or my right foot or drive to work at an average 40kph is to blame for my bad economy.......
aussiejk
29-09-11, 12:48 PM
I regret getting the rubicon fuel economy is terrible get diesel model and get a manual.. Easier and cheaper to repair should sonething go wrong... With plenty of ppl selling off thing off rubicons you can beef up your diesel model with the lower tcase gearing and the diffs with the lockers, ratio's are normally swapped out depending on tyre size you are running
My 2 door petrol rubicon is running 33s MTZ on standard ratios 3.12 and returns 11.2------13.5l/100ks. The figures were alot different before I used the Procal to adjust everything
aussiejk
29-09-11, 03:01 PM
cost of servicing a diesel model isn't all that much more, if this is a concern of your don't take it to a stealer... The real cost of dealers are the mark up on prices..... Well known generic brands are half the price of genuine items even at trade prices, there isn't much difference in the price of after market parts between the 2 either....
your average mechanic's service price will be very similar in prices diesel or Petrol,
I can help out with servicing as I am a liceneced motor mechanic.. This goes for all members I will look after all the best i can and will charge trade price on all parts... labour for me is $55 per hour... going through the the crap to make it a legit operation bussiness atm.. so will officaly post up when i am trading..
aussiejk
29-09-11, 03:02 PM
My 2 door petrol rubicon is running 33s MTZ on standard ratios 3.12 and returns 11.2------13.5l/100ks. The figures were alot different before I used the Procal to adjust everything
????
rubicons have 4.10 ratio's standard...
I regret getting the rubicon fuel economy is terrible get diesel model and get a manual.. Easier and cheaper to repair should sonething go wrong... With plenty of ppl selling off thing off rubicons you can beef up your diesel model with the lower tcase gearing and the diffs with the lockers, ratio's are normally swapped out depending on tyre size you are running
and when the clutch packs up?
Took me ages to settle on mine as I really wanted a diesel manual, but the wait time was ridiculous so opted for the auto instead... THANK GOD I DID.
The auto (while a little old fashioned, no tip-tronic and you can't select 3rd at all) is UNREAL and so easy when 4WDing and with the 4.56 gears it launches off the mark.
Im talking with Roo Systems right now about there exhaust and chip system together with there new intercooler system which combined should give me 25-35% more power - the fuel saving part there is you should be able to change to a higher gear sooner.
I've already had this discussion with Reysor! my 07 rubicon came from the factory with 3.21 axle ratios. previous post incorrectly stated 3.12 ratio
Bear
Yep all Rubicons have the 3.21 axle ratios Bear... the 4.1 stated above is your unreal transfer case... would love to get my hands on one of those ;)
aussiejk
29-09-11, 07:48 PM
Go look in owners manual it clearly states all rubicon models have got 4.10 ratio in diff gears
aussiejk
29-09-11, 07:50 PM
and when the clutch packs up?
550 fitted.... When your auto fills with water good luck getting home have fun with expensive auto repairs if the clutch packs let go in a auto it will be very expensive especially been a jeep... Over heating autos slip... Manual you can keep changing gears even with out a clutch... Anything else....
if this that easy to fix, why are there countless people with clutch issues.......id still prefer an auto over the manual... makes everything so much easier.
good luck taking off at a set of lights in a manual without a clutch.
simple fix for an overheating trans is a tranny cooler (not the kind that colin got from thailand).....
http://www.ausjeepoffroad.com/forum/showthread.php?t=109426
have a read.........
im talkign abotu the desiel manual here not the petrol........ the desiel basically has to much torque for the clutch and flywheel to handle......
and my Rubi came with 4.10 diff ratios and a 4.11 t/case.......
aussiejk
01-10-11, 05:40 PM
rey each have there advantages and disvantages, you like auto i like manual.. for me auto takes fun away from it all... and i have seen first hand what damage mud and water does to an auto i know they are expensive to repair trust me... as for taking off from lights witth no clutch start the car in gear... you may say cant do that in a JK because you need to put your foot on the clutch to start yes but there is a flash at the dealer to take this off... Also I drive my JK hard very hard offroad on road and in the mud people that came out to zig zag will agree i was stuck in the mud for 10mins dumping clutch like crazy forward and reverse and it still feel very good at the foot pedal...
Interesting comments about the flaws of an auto. I would have thought the auto was more a sealed unit than a manual due to more parts moving in a manual. None the less, as has been stated there are pros and cons for all configurations.
For me it would be an auto diesel at the right price and an unlimited at least 2010 model. Manuals are great in sports cars but around town and on a 4wd, Why?? In tricky terrain the auto will win each time in my view. Only exception is decents, where the manual is a better option due to engine compression.
I do however appreciate all comments in helping me decide more next Jeep or will it be???
im not talking about personal preferance, im talking about real life issues with teh manual in the diesel.... the petrol is fine in manual as it doesnt have a pwer/torque to fry the clutch
I had a good long yarn to a fellow from Scuderia Veloce Jeep today and he suggested that the new Pentastar V6 is the one to go for (all new orders for petrol Wranglers being placed will get this motor - the 3.8 is dead), he even suggested that the V6 is better than the diesel. Also the diesel is no longer being made in the 2 door Wrangler.
So now I too do not know what one to settle for, an auto diesel (it was my preference) or the new V6 Rubicon auto (both in Unlimited) as price is very similar (about 2k difference - if that).
aussiejk
05-10-11, 03:31 PM
this thread giniks my clutch slave cylinder went.. thank god local dealer had one... they are plastic to... so fits well with the rest of the JK... normal price was $218 i got it for $189 with my trade discount, so for reference if anyone needs one PM ill get it trade for you...
Interesting comments about the flaws of an auto. I would have thought the auto was more a sealed unit than a manual due to more parts moving in a manual. None the less, as has been stated there are pros and cons for all configurations.
For me it would be an auto diesel at the right price and an unlimited at least 2010 model. Manuals are great in sports cars but around town and on a 4wd, Why?? In tricky terrain the auto will win each time in my view. Only exception is decents, where the manual is a better option due to engine compression.
I do however appreciate all comments in helping me decide more next Jeep or will it be???
Some Rubi drivers got pee'd with me everytime I would call on the radio,"get off the brake, use your low ratio"........ My auto( but do have Terralow T/Case) is just as efficient as the Rubi's low ratio on decents, nevers runs away at all, but near got a chill when I hit almost 4Km down a slope one day....Lol........
Auto vs Manual = personal choice really...............
Cpage66
06-10-11, 10:46 AM
I had a good long yarn to a fellow from Scuderia Veloce Jeep today and he suggested that the new Pentastar V6 is the one to go for (all new orders for petrol Wranglers being placed will get this motor - the 3.8 is dead), he even suggested that the V6 is better than the diesel. Also the diesel is no longer being made in the 2 door Wrangler.
So now I too do not know what one to settle for, an auto diesel (it was my preference) or the new V6 Rubicon auto (both in Unlimited) as price is very similar (about 2k difference - if that).
Drove a new Town and Country when we were back in the States in August and September with the new V6...it's a rip snortin' little beast in that heavy thing. Burn't rubber as we pulled out of the rental lot.
It would be interesting to see the price drop of the old petrols once the new 6 comes out. The dealers even think the diesel will drop too and any old stock wil become a bargain.
I wonder what the economy will be like with the new one compared with the current?
aussiejk
08-10-11, 03:50 PM
reading on the US forums there isn't much of a difference in economey but there are some major issues with the exhaust when lifting you need exhaust spacers and all sorts of trouble i would rather steer clear off...
There is a really nice dark sky blue special 2 door project at Jeep Mosman
Comes with 17x8 black Pro-comp (i Think they were) wheels and 305/70/17 pro-comp tyres, Lift (about 3" I think) all engineered and tuned, custom front & rear steel bars (not that nice IMO) and side rails plus a few other bits. I wonder if the lift will be OK under new rules. hmmm....
They want $50k petrol. the Jeep looks VERY cool though.
There is a really nice dark sky blue special 2 door project at Jeep Mosman
Comes with 17x8 black Pro-comp (i Think they were) wheels and 305/70/17 pro-comp tyres, Lift (about 3" I think) all engineered and tuned, custom front & rear steel bars (not that nice IMO) and side rails plus a few other bits. I wonder if the lift will be OK under new rules. hmmm....
They want $50k petrol. the Jeep looks VERY cool though.
Steve C.,
All you need to remember is "Black TJ", forget the rest..........Lol........
Manual= Everytime the clutch is engaged, it create's a vaccum so ANY weakness's etc will soon show and mud/crap soon fill it... Better, longer breathers do not hurt either.......
Auto= Should be properly sealed, longer breather's, sitting in deep puddles for extended periods is no issue but it did shyte the rear D35 a short time later.............
Auto's can overheat & slip but manual's also can basically do the same..Stop you dead in your tracks....But it is a great look on the face of an manual driver when they stall on a climb............Lol.............
reading on the US forums there isn't much of a difference in economey but there are some major issues with the exhaust when lifting you need exhaust spacers and all sorts of trouble i would rather steer clear off...
all you have to do is add a small spacer to the exhaust.... its not that hard really.....
All this info has been good and I and I'm many others would like to know as much as possible from real drivers of the wrangler.
Thanks
Can yo guys who have changed their wheels let me know what you have chosen? In particular the make/model and specs of the wheels
Thanks
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